Comments on: Nietzsche and Tolkien: reviewing the Will to Power http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/ Blogging on Philosophy and Politics Wed, 21 Dec 2011 09:09:48 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Yet There Is Method In It » Blog Archive » Nietzsche and Tolkien 5: Thus Spake Gandalf http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-150 Yet There Is Method In It » Blog Archive » Nietzsche and Tolkien 5: Thus Spake Gandalf Thu, 28 Jun 2007 16:07:47 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-150 [...] articles: 1 2 3 3.5 [...] [...] articles: 1 2 3 3.5 [...]

]]> By: El Sordo http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-149 El Sordo Sat, 16 Jun 2007 19:35:20 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-149 Also however, slightly modifying my last comment. The 'unpalatable truth' that one should discard the previous moral constraints is a necessary part of existentialism. Thus at the point of engagement, just as you said, we must rule nothing in or nothing out. My form of Kierkegaardian existentialism starts at the same position, but thats where the whole leap of faith comes in, attempting to overcome the paradox. A Christian existentialism might say, 'disregard all you have been told', only for the existentialist eventually to turn full circle and reach the same conclusions that once they had presupposed. However this time the the conclusions you have reached have a meaningful relevence to them, having lived the 'means' in finding the 'end'. Brings us back to my old friend Irenaus. We are made in the image of God, but... we grow in his likeness. Also however, slightly modifying my last comment. The ‘unpalatable truth’ that one should discard the previous moral constraints is a necessary part of existentialism.
Thus at the point of engagement, just as you said, we must rule nothing in or nothing out.
My form of Kierkegaardian existentialism starts at the same position, but thats where the whole leap of faith comes in, attempting to overcome the paradox.
A Christian existentialism might say, ‘disregard all you have been told’, only for the existentialist eventually to turn full circle and reach the same conclusions that once they had presupposed. However this time the the conclusions you have reached have a meaningful relevence to them, having lived the ‘means’ in finding the ‘end’.
Brings us back to my old friend Irenaus. We are made in the image of God, but… we grow in his likeness.

]]> By: El Sordo http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-148 El Sordo Sat, 16 Jun 2007 15:28:42 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-148 We agree on something then :) Are suggesting that it is possible to have a positive-Nietzscean ideal and a negative-Nietzschean ideal? What then makes the negative ideal so negative? Could it be your taste? If so then isn't Nietzscehan ethics an irreducible relativism of the worst kind? Will read in depth your two further posts, and may also post a review on the Simpsons philosophy, is Bart Nietzches bad boy? We agree on something then :)

Are suggesting that it is possible to have a positive-Nietzscean ideal and a negative-Nietzschean ideal?
What then makes the negative ideal so negative? Could it be your taste? If so then isn’t Nietzscehan ethics an irreducible relativism of the worst kind?

Will read in depth your two further posts, and may also post a review on the Simpsons philosophy, is Bart Nietzches bad boy?

]]> By: Anti Citizen One http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-147 Anti Citizen One Sat, 16 Jun 2007 10:24:09 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-147 "Furthermore in my quest for domination, shouldnt I choose to ignore (where it suits me) those taboos that have previously provided me with a moral restraint upon my actions, i.e. racism, sexism, homophobia and so on?" This is the mind boggling aspect of his philosophy. Since he is starting from Existentialism, it almost goes without saying that our previous moral restaints no longer apply. Or at least their past justifications no longer apply. Nietzsche refuses to rule anything in or out. "I erect no new idols; let the old idols learn what it means to have legs of clay." That is why it is no easy to misuse or misapply Nietzsche's ideas. AC1 “Furthermore in my quest for domination, shouldnt I choose to ignore (where it suits me) those taboos that have previously provided me with a moral restraint upon my actions, i.e. racism, sexism, homophobia and so on?”

This is the mind boggling aspect of his philosophy. Since he is starting from Existentialism, it almost goes without saying that our previous moral restaints no longer apply. Or at least their past justifications no longer apply. Nietzsche refuses to rule anything in or out. “I erect no new idols; let the old idols learn what it means to have legs of clay.”

That is why it is no easy to misuse or misapply Nietzsche’s ideas.

AC1

]]> By: El Sordo http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-146 El Sordo Fri, 15 Jun 2007 16:04:00 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-146 Yes the philology connection hadn't escaped me. Before I undertook Philosophy/Theology I had discussed with someone my pre-wittgenstein ideals (very close to LW actually) and this person recommended that I studied Philology. I was very close to becoming a linguist instead of a philosopher of linguistics. Thankyou for your correction on the eternal recurrence of history. As I was writing it I was pondering upon whether he was desribing history is circular and possibly even pre-rationlising the concept of retrocausality. Obviously he was not. Incidentally it is one of his ideas that I find reasonably palatable. Yes the philology connection hadn’t escaped me. Before I undertook Philosophy/Theology I had discussed with someone my pre-wittgenstein ideals (very close to LW actually) and this person recommended that I studied Philology. I was very close to becoming a linguist instead of a philosopher of linguistics.

Thankyou for your correction on the eternal recurrence of history. As I was writing it I was pondering upon whether he was desribing history is circular and possibly even pre-rationlising the concept of retrocausality. Obviously he was not. Incidentally it is one of his ideas that I find reasonably palatable.

]]> By: Anti Citizen One http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-145 Anti Citizen One Thu, 14 Jun 2007 21:39:53 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-145 Ironically Tolkien and Nietzsche were both studied philology and I think were lecturers in it! Both are more famous for their work outside that field. A drift in the opposite direction: Wittgenstein started in aeronautics and became famous for has work on language (and I guess words). AC1 Ironically Tolkien and Nietzsche were both studied philology and I think were lecturers in it! Both are more famous for their work outside that field.

A drift in the opposite direction: Wittgenstein started in aeronautics and became famous for has work on language (and I guess words).

AC1

]]> By: Anti Citizen One http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-144 Anti Citizen One Thu, 14 Jun 2007 18:59:39 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-144 The main (only?) correction I want to make is about the nature of the Eternal Return. History itself moves forward, otherwise we could never reach for the superman. The Eternal Return is like reincarnation into the same life again and again. So I have types these words in before - AND I AWAYS WILL. lol! I am still not sure I personally interpret the Eternal Return. "What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: 'This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more' ... Would you not throw yourself down and gnash your teeth and curse the demon who spoke thus? Or have you once experienced a tremendous moment when you would have answered him: 'You are a god and never have I heard anything more divine.' [The Gay Science, §341]" Apparently, that is one acid test for a superman. AC1 The main (only?) correction I want to make is about the nature of the Eternal Return. History itself moves forward, otherwise we could never reach for the superman. The Eternal Return is like reincarnation into the same life again and again. So I have types these words in before – AND I AWAYS WILL. lol! I am still not sure I personally interpret the Eternal Return.

“What, if some day or night a demon were to steal after you into your loneliest loneliness and say to you: ‘This life as you now live it and have lived it, you will have to live once more and innumerable times more’ … Would you not throw yourself down and gnash your teeth and curse the demon who spoke thus? Or have you once experienced a tremendous moment when you would have answered him: ‘You are a god and never have I heard anything more divine.’ [The Gay Science, §341]”

Apparently, that is one acid test for a superman.

AC1

]]> By: Yet There Is Method In It » Blog Archive » Nietzsche and Tolkien 2: The Valar http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/comment-page-1/#comment-143 Yet There Is Method In It » Blog Archive » Nietzsche and Tolkien 2: The Valar Thu, 14 Jun 2007 18:32:54 +0000 http://www.methodinit.org.uk/methodinit/2007/06/14/nietzsche-and-tolkien-reviewing-the-will-to-power/#comment-143 [...] epic fantasy fiction. The stories are written with a subtly Catholic ethical backdrop. I agree with your posting, that Nietzsche’s world view is incompatible with Tolkien’s created world. I will argue [...] [...] epic fantasy fiction. The stories are written with a subtly Catholic ethical backdrop. I agree with your posting, that Nietzsche’s world view is incompatible with Tolkien’s created world. I will argue [...]

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